Simon Norris crashes AGAIN!

[retrodan]

Originally Posted by Minishonk

the guy in the red one was trying hard and i personally think he was going well he was right on the limits and even with the power differance he was all over the norris design car i disagree with dan and twinturbo he isnt the best driver in the world no but he had a few minor moments which we all do when on the limits and then you can hear him pumping the brakes and nothing.. he didnt crash because he is a bad driver and proberly would of kept going round and round if the brakes didnt go, so a bit unfair to blame him for ruining the other guys car because its clear he does everything he can not to smash into the car infront, it was just unfortunate

dude his bad driving is why his brakes went tits up, u dont see any of the other cars loosing their brakes, i would like to say maybe he should try slowing down before the corner rather than slamming brakes on in one go, then being able to take a smoother line and putting power down earlier and smoother, not trowing at a corner and smashing pedals all about, in fact i would say 90 percent of the drifters i know skid a track smoother than he drives it lol

[Mr Bizzle]

Driving was appauling, shifting up mid corner, bad braking, lines were wrong on many occasions. The guy in the red Evo looked a bit better tho.

[stubb]

at least he has the tool kit to fix both cars up

[initial_j]

brake fluid boiling and loosing brakes isnt an excuse id be happy with if it was my evo hed smacked into.

i thought they are spose to know a thing or two about evos? surely theyd take into consideration how long to stay out and push it before letting the brakes cool down a bit? i know its not a 100 percent predictable science but if your gonna drive at that level for that long, its something you should think about when building the car..

either way i bet it seriously fricking hurt, was the other driver injured?

[initial_j]

another vid from different angle:

YouTube - Norris evo crash @ Castle combe

[TwinturboCH]

I dare say his brakes DID fail, but thats because he was driving REALLY badly. If he'd had the same power as the guy in the orange evo he wouldn't have even made it into the lead, you see the straight line advantage when the race starts.
Either way, his accident avoidance was terrible and there is no excuse for taking out someone elses car like that, using the handbrake to just throw it into the turn with scant regard for other peoples (i.e. drivers) safety is pretty poor racecraft in my opinion, hence bad driver.

[Jore]

Whatching the video for a few times I would have guessed something broke from suspension/steering like lower arm bar or tie rod or something. This is because the steering wheel took really quick turn to right throwing the car to side of the track.

Won't believe that anybody who has ever driven on a track would take the car to grass on that point even when brakes would be gone. I mean, it had to be over quickly but doing something on tarmac (lower gear and release the clutch f. ex.) would have given even slightly more changes to lower the speed before smashing.

[StuyMac]

Granted, his driving style may be unorthadox, but the Clerk of the course cleared him of fault and found it to be a mechanical (brakes) problem.

He will also have had all the evidence seen on the tinterweb, and more.....

[Ed.]

Horses mouth Mitsubishi Lancer Register Forum - View Single Post - Si Norris at Combe 05-05-08. OH DEAR!!

[Jore]

I just don't get that idea, but propably it's just me.. Other odd thing is to have "650Hp Evo 9 RS Race Car" as he states and still have brakes that can completely boil your brake fluids :/

But ofcourse most important thing is that nobody got injured. More EVO's can be bought from shop.

[BanjoMaster]

Originally Posted by TwinturboCH

I dare say his brakes DID fail, but thats because he was driving REALLY badly. If he'd had the same power as the guy in the orange evo he wouldn't have even made it into the lead, you see the straight line advantage when the race starts.
Either way, his accident avoidance was terrible and there is no excuse for taking out someone elses car like that, using the handbrake to just throw it into the turn with scant regard for other peoples (i.e. drivers) safety is pretty poor racecraft in my opinion, hence bad driver.

Hahaha, did Simon Norris recently buttsecks your mum or something?

[Keefe]

Originally Posted by Jore

Other odd thing is to have "650Hp Evo 9 RS Race Car" as he states and still have brakes that can completely boil your brake fluids :/

Rubbish. The heat on the brakes during a session like that is monumental, even if your brakes are ducted, vented, using silicon fluid etc etc it doesn't matter, they still get massively hot, all you can do is try slow the process down. Our own car boiled its fluid by the end of a session at castle combe too come to think of it, and that has all the right braking kit, proper stuff, not just stuff you slap on a road car.

This threads a bit ridiculous, how everybody becomes an expert race analysist everytime someone messes up. It happens. Pretty frequently too if you've ever spent time within a racing season either as part of a team or participating in races yourself.

You simply cannot take the perfect line every single time, you just can't. Especially when you're around halfway through and your tyres go off and are seriously the worse things you'll ever drive on, no matter how good they're supposed to be.

Its clear that Norris isn't the worlds greatest driver, but then again he hasn't been at it that long iirc. I know he's been building monster evos forever but the driving part, especially circuit is relatively new isn't it? So yeah there's a lot of things he could of done differently when you've got the luxury of hindsight but its a completely different story when you're sat in the car at the time. You can't say what he was doing was wrong because you can't feel what that car's doing through your arse like he could.

As for the car understeering then oversteering i'd say that's something that needs dialling out with set up and is probably due to the tyres as i said plus the massive amount of power, so this needs taking into account. As for when he went off, he could of dealt with it better, he should have being shadowing his brakes well before the corner so he could feel how much braking he had, and consequently adjust accordingly.

But, like i say, it's easy to say all this with hindsight and he just needs a bit more experience. The orange evo was unlucky, but it happens, i'm sure he'll be over it by now.

[veilsideluke]

def brake failure. had it plenty of times myself but not been that unlucky thank god!! looks like they failed and then understeered and in trying to correct it massively oversteered under power and pulled a wheel onto the grass, no way back from that. very unlucky to take the other guy out. hope they wer both ok. agree with guy above. its all good saying stuff but its so different when doing that on the track. u forget everything at hat speed and just let experience and feel for the car take over.

[BanjoMaster]

Originally Posted by Keefe

Rubbish. The heat on the brakes during a session like that is monumental, even if your brakes are ducted, vented, using silicon fluid etc etc it doesn't matter, they still get massively hot, all you can do is try slow the process down. Our own car boiled its fluid by the end of a session at castle combe too come to think of it, and that has all the right braking kit, proper stuff, not just stuff you slap on a road car.

This threads a bit ridiculous, how everybody becomes an expert race analysist everytime someone messes up. It happens. Pretty frequently too if you've ever spent time within a racing season either as part of a team or participating in races yourself.

You simply cannot take the perfect line every single time, you just can't. Especially when you're around halfway through and your tyres go off and are seriously the worse things you'll ever drive on, no matter how good they're supposed to be.

Its clear that Norris isn't the worlds greatest driver, but then again he hasn't been at it that long iirc. I know he's been building monster evos forever but the driving part, especially circuit is relatively new isn't it? So yeah there's a lot of things he could of done differently when you've got the luxury of hindsight but its a completely different story when you're sat in the car at the time. You can't say what he was doing was wrong because you can't feel what that car's doing through your arse like he could.

As for the car understeering then oversteering i'd say that's something that needs dialling out with set up and is probably due to the tyres as i said plus the massive amount of power, so this needs taking into account. As for when he went off, he could of dealt with it better, he should have being shadowing his brakes well before the corner so he could feel how much braking he had, and consequently adjust accordingly.

But, like i say, it's easy to say all this with hindsight and he just needs a bit more experience. The orange evo was unlucky, but it happens, i'm sure he'll be over it by now.

Perfectly put. This thread should probably end on this post.

[Ed.]

Originally Posted by Keefe

This threads a bit ridiculous, how everybody becomes an expert race analysist everytime someone messes up. It happens. Pretty frequently too if you've ever spent time within a racing season either as part of a team or participating in races yourself.

Its the internet thats why. I pity anyone new who comes here at times for a look and to see what the uk drift community is like Bring back the 2004-early 2005 version of this forum, much tighter and less idiots

[sideways.taff]

Originally Posted by Ed.

Bring back the 2004-early 2005 version of this forum, much tighter and less idiots

But you were here back then too... so this place still had its share of idiots

[TwinturboCH]

Originally Posted by sideways.taff

But you were here back then too... so this place still had its share of idiots

LOL

Thing is, Ed is on about K1ers and kids, and you can't really call Initial_J, Bizzle, Rochey, Taff, Dan or myself either of those, unless you are talking about mental age of course so yea, must be on about himself

[V-MAX]

It's a shame people are so quick to critisize others when we all make mistakes...
We should all remember he was running at the front of a race, he thought he had a chance to win it and his heart would of been beating out of his chest with excitement, he would probably be heavy breathing and getting a little flustered with the pressure. Anyone who has raced and won will know this feeling.
I think he was doing great up to the point of the crash, to control what looked like a very powerful and nervous handling car at the limit, at least his limit.

For what it's worth I looked closely at the video and I think he selected nuetral on the way into that corner, probably distracted by the backmarkers. If you look at the positioning of the gearstick when in 3rd, 4th and 5th prior to the crash, it looks in between 3rd and 4th as he turned in, this explains the turn in oversteer and why he seemed to not slow down? At first I thought he may have gone from 5th to 3rd but the gear stick position doesn't quite look right for that? It's a big shame for the guy he ran into. Just my 2 penneth, not wanting to pee people off

[Rochey]

Originally Posted by Keefe

This threads a bit ridiculous, how everybody becomes an expert race analysist everytime someone messes up. It happens. Pretty frequently too if you've ever spent time within a racing season either as part of a team or participating in races yourself.

You simply cannot take the perfect line every single time, you just can't. Especially when you're around halfway through and your tyres go off and are seriously the worse things you'll ever drive on, no matter how good they're supposed to be.

Its clear that Norris isn't the worlds greatest driver, but then again he hasn't been at it that long iirc. I know he's been building monster evos forever but the driving part, especially circuit is relatively new isn't it? So yeah there's a lot of things he could of done differently when you've got the luxury of hindsight but its a completely different story when you're sat in the car at the time. You can't say what he was doing was wrong because you can't feel what that car's doing through your arse like he could.

Precisley what I was getting at in my post at the beginning, people can't compare an amatuer race to F1, they are worlds apart. Getting the line right everytime is what seperates a pro from a novice/ amatuer/ clubman racer.
When I look back at my own on board footage I see my mistakes, of which there are far too many but I learnt from them and I try to focus on not making them again. My mates on the other hand watch it and are quick to point them out and tell me how it happened, desipite having never driven a race car in their lives.

I would make a slightly off topic comment about the time attack/ performance saloon race phenomenon. A racing driver, clubman or otherwise, learns to race in a balanced, purpose built, low power, low or no technology race car. It teaches a driver to be smooth and precise as there are no trick diffs or suspension and little power, to pull it back on line when a mistake is made. When looking at this example and others I have seen, it makes me think that the drivers are way out of their depth trying to wrestle a 600+bhp monster around a track. If, in this case, the driver had spend a few years racing a one make class formula car, Vee, Ford, Caterham etc, he'd have built up a driving style and awareness to harness the power of that Evo.
Just my two cents.

[Jore]

What was that competition they were driving on in that vid?