Arch Rolling question - Drifting forum

Bunny · 01-09-2008, 09:43

Right when rolling the arches does anyone cut the inner arch to get a good flair.

Cyruz · 01-09-2008, 10:39

Do you mean the inner lip where it bends at about 90 degree's inward. If so then yes lots of people do but it does make the arch a bit weaker, I'll be doing this as soon as I can be bothered.

royal · 01-09-2008, 10:42

Sometimes removing the inner fold is enough to sort out the rubbing, and also its easy then to scaffold bar them

robbs · 01-09-2008, 10:47

yeah slingo cut the inner arch on his r32 rolled and flared then welded it back together, i wouldn't advise cutting the inner arch without welding it back though as it makes the arches weaker.

Bunny · 01-09-2008, 10:57

LOL @ Dave that's exactly what i've done. But removing the fold was definately not enough

Basically i've been using a bar to roll them. Drivers side flair is not bad but it's pulled the inner arch away from the outer arch. Made it easier for flaring lmao. But i'll need to cut it and weld it back on.

The other side didn't do this and i'm struggling to get it to flair. Hence the question. I'll cut it \ flair it and weld it back on

oli · 01-09-2008, 10:58

not always the case, I've seen flare without removing that lip but folding it flat. depends on the car and the way the arches/bumpers sit in relation to each other.

Bunny · 01-09-2008, 11:01

Removing\folding the lip is not enough. The wheels were sticking out about 1.5"s from the outside of the arch.

oli · 01-09-2008, 11:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bunny

Removing\folding the lip is not enough. The wheels were sticking out about 1.5"s from the outside of the arch.

pics? and rim specs pls

Bunny · 01-09-2008, 11:41

I can't upload pics mate. Work internet doesn't allow it and i don't have internet at home at the moment.

It's an R33 skyline but after borring some of Stevo's ET12 wheels and seeing what they looked like i thought i'd chuck on some 25mm spacers lol and roll away.

Rayne · 01-09-2008, 21:21

Bunny, think +30mm over fenders for the rims you are borrowing at the moment.

Also is +12 the offset of the rim without 25mm spacer? If so, that 25 mm spacer is going to make the rim have a -13 offset.

Heck with a spacer that big you might as well find wider rims.

griffo20022 · 01-09-2008, 21:34

Interesting to see the mixed reviews, I'm hopefully gonna roll the arches on my E36 by the weekend. My initial plan was to just fold that inner lip flat rather than cut it out.

royal · 01-09-2008, 21:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rayne

Also is +12 the offset of the rim without 25mm spacer? If so, that 25 mm spacer is going to make the rim have a -13 offset.

Heck with a spacer that big you might as well find wider rims.

Don't you mean the other way around dude? A +12 offset and a 25mm spacer will bring the mounting point to +37mm inside of the rim center and give a wider track I think?

Cyruz · 01-09-2008, 23:01

griffo, the arches are really tough on the 36, i folded mine and they really didn't want to move much after that, im going to cut them off and then flare them, might weld the lip back in if i can be bothered.

Don't fold the lip in if your going to cut, now I have to prise mine out again to cut it...!

NORFY · 01-09-2008, 23:18

hammond rolled the arches on my 13 today with a bit of old exhaust, and they come out sweet. flattened the lip down first

Rayne · 02-09-2008, 01:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by royal

Don't you mean the other way around dude? A +12 offset and a 25mm spacer will bring the mounting point to +37mm inside of the rim center and give a wider track I think?

When I first started studying rims and tires I thought adding a spacer would bring the mounting point to higher number.

However an individual needs to realize that negative offset moves the rim closer to the fenders. Positive offset moves the rim closer to the suspension components.

Click here for a diagram. Looking at the diagram, if and when an individual adds a spacer in between the hub and the mounting pad of the wheel, the offset is effectively changed so that space can be added between a part being rubbed and the tire or the rim face.

Now there is a way to make an offset of a rim higher than it was originally. However to do that individual is looking at modifying the rim itself.

superclarkey · 02-09-2008, 01:35

well a stock 200sx S14 with 9.5J ET12 needs a bloody good flair to fit 265 rubber under the back but if your running gay strech then you'll get away with it, adding a 25mm spacer is pointless and lets face it the rollcenter is already going to be trashed when you've cut your springs down to the chassis rails

I wouldn't bother and you will be hanging out of your 50mm overfenders with them spacers

Bunny · 02-09-2008, 09:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by superclarkey

well a stock 200sx S14 with 9.5J ET12 needs a bloody good flair to fit 265 rubber under the back but if your running gay strech then you'll get away with it, adding a 25mm spacer is pointless and lets face it the rollcenter is already going to be trashed when you've cut your springs down to the chassis rails

I wouldn't bother and you will be hanging out of your 50mm overfenders with them spacers

I don't have an S14 and i certainly am not running on Cut springs.

The ET12's are not on the car anymore they were borrowed for a trial fit.
i've got gay offset et38 wheels hence the spacers.

Yes i rolled the lip first. Yes i've done a flair on 1 side so far because it needs it. When i get time i'll finish the other side and weld the inner arches back.

royal · 02-09-2008, 10:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rayne

When I first started studying rims and tires I thought adding a spacer would bring the mounting point to higher number.

However an individual needs to realize that negative offset moves the rim closer to the fenders. Positive offset moves the rim closer to the suspension components.

Click here for a diagram. Looking at the diagram, if and when an individual adds a spacer in between the hub and the mounting pad of the wheel, the offset is effectively changed so that space can be added between a part being rubbed and the tire or the rim face.

Now there is a way to make an offset of a rim higher than it was originally. However to do that individual is looking at modifying the rim itself.

I wondered why I was getting confused. Your diagram doesn't work but I looked up some sites and turns out the all singing, all dancing fancy arse suspension book I've got (how to make your car handle, fred puhn) has it the other way round to everywhere else! God knows why, or I'm just being a bone head?

Rayne · 02-09-2008, 11:15

As long as you understand that spacers actually lower the offset rather than increase it. You know all that you need to know where spacers are concerned.

01-09-2008, 09:43	#1 (permalink)
Bunny FAIL Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Milton Keynes Posts: 2,184	Arch Rolling question Right when rolling the arches does anyone cut the inner arch to get a good flair.

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01-09-2008, 10:39	#2 (permalink)
Cyruz e-Dirty-6 Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Bournemouth/Plymouth Posts: 1,392	Do you mean the inner lip where it bends at about 90 degree's inward. If so then yes lots of people do but it does make the arch a bit weaker, I'll be doing this as soon as I can be bothered.

01-09-2008, 10:42	#3 (permalink)
royal S1- F.T break! Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 4,852	Sometimes removing the inner fold is enough to sort out the rubbing, and also its easy then to scaffold bar them

01-09-2008, 10:47	#4 (permalink)
robbs MANJI MAN Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: FAREHAM (Almost-Portsmouth-ish) Posts: 4,038	yeah slingo cut the inner arch on his r32 rolled and flared then welded it back together, i wouldn't advise cutting the inner arch without welding it back though as it makes the arches weaker.

01-09-2008, 10:57	#5 (permalink)
Bunny FAIL Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Milton Keynes Posts: 2,184	LOL @ Dave that's exactly what i've done. But removing the fold was definately not enough Basically i've been using a bar to roll them. Drivers side flair is not bad but it's pulled the inner arch away from the outer arch. Made it easier for flaring lmao. But i'll need to cut it and weld it back on. The other side didn't do this and i'm struggling to get it to flair. Hence the question. I'll cut it \ flair it and weld it back on

01-09-2008, 10:58	#6 (permalink)
oli -nightspirit- Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: swindon Posts: 4,965	not always the case, I've seen flare without removing that lip but folding it flat. depends on the car and the way the arches/bumpers sit in relation to each other.

01-09-2008, 11:01	#7 (permalink)
Bunny FAIL Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Milton Keynes Posts: 2,184	Removing\folding the lip is not enough. The wheels were sticking out about 1.5"s from the outside of the arch.

01-09-2008, 11:41	#9 (permalink)
Bunny FAIL Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Milton Keynes Posts: 2,184	I can't upload pics mate. Work internet doesn't allow it and i don't have internet at home at the moment. It's an R33 skyline but after borring some of Stevo's ET12 wheels and seeing what they looked like i thought i'd chuck on some 25mm spacers lol and roll away.

01-09-2008, 21:21	#10 (permalink)
Rayne tail slider Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: On the other side of Atlantic ocean. Posts: 115	Bunny, think +30mm over fenders for the rims you are borrowing at the moment. Also is +12 the offset of the rim without 25mm spacer? If so, that 25 mm spacer is going to make the rim have a -13 offset. Heck with a spacer that big you might as well find wider rims.

01-09-2008, 21:34	#11 (permalink)
griffo20022 BMW Driver... Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Wolverhampton Posts: 1,239	Interesting to see the mixed reviews, I'm hopefully gonna roll the arches on my E36 by the weekend. My initial plan was to just fold that inner lip flat rather than cut it out.

01-09-2008, 23:01	#13 (permalink)
Cyruz e-Dirty-6 Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Bournemouth/Plymouth Posts: 1,392	griffo, the arches are really tough on the 36, i folded mine and they really didn't want to move much after that, im going to cut them off and then flare them, might weld the lip back in if i can be bothered. Don't fold the lip in if your going to cut, now I have to prise mine out again to cut it...!

01-09-2008, 23:18	#14 (permalink)
NORFY dorifto kingu! Join Date: May 2008 Location: faversham, kent Posts: 945	hammond rolled the arches on my 13 today with a bit of old exhaust, and they come out sweet. flattened the lip down first

02-09-2008, 01:35	#16 (permalink)
superclarkey ______________ Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 9,252	well a stock 200sx S14 with 9.5J ET12 needs a bloody good flair to fit 265 rubber under the back but if your running gay strech then you'll get away with it, adding a 25mm spacer is pointless and lets face it the rollcenter is already going to be trashed when you've cut your springs down to the chassis rails I wouldn't bother and you will be hanging out of your 50mm overfenders with them spacers

02-09-2008, 11:15	#19 (permalink)
Rayne tail slider Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: On the other side of Atlantic ocean. Posts: 115	As long as you understand that spacers actually lower the offset rather than increase it. You know all that you need to know where spacers are concerned.