Turbo dilemmas - in theory this won't work...?

Thread in 'Technical Questions' started by Munkul, Jan 19, 2012.

  1. Munkul

    Munkul Active Member

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    Here goes.

    I bought a holset hy35 off ebay cheap a while back. Totally unknown history, and no badgeplate. The housings had been shotblasted and what feel like new seals/bearings fitted, anyways it would be like new if it wasnt for a slightly damaged compressor wheel.

    Now the strange thing is, the hy35's have quite a bit of info on them out there, with them being a good quick-spool alternative to a hx35, with an almost identical compressor side flowing 58-60lb/min. In all the info I have found, they are ALWAYS referred to as having aT3 flanged housing with a 9cm2 nozzle area.

    Now this is what mine looks like:

    http://www.myholsetturbo.com/manuals/HY35W.pdf

    It looks identical to the type C.

    Now here's the strange thing - Mine has a T2 flanged housing???!!! And its not a regular T2 shaped hole - the area isnt as big, with it looking more like an ellipse than a radiused box.

    Turbine wheel has inducer: 65mm, exducer: 52mm.
    Turbine housing has numbers cast into it: HOLSET 16E6 3592768 7 164 02 TW 2 (I can find no info from googling)

    Now Ive been doing some rough A/R calcs - picking a random point about 40mm into the top of the flange, I get an area of 1.056cm2, and a radius to centre of 7cm. Now this only gives an A/R of 0.15....???

    Is that not incredibly small? Am I measuring it right?

    More importantly, how useful does this housing look for me with all this in mind? It was intended to fit to an sr20, aiming for around 350whp. But I'm worried that this exhaust housing is smaller than than the regular 9cm2 housing, causing it to choke well before it reaches it's full potential...

    Of course, i could find a knackered hy35 and rob its housing, but they are like hens teeth!!!

    Anyone got any useful input on this? Stav or someone, who knows a bit about these?

    Cheers
     
    #1 Munkul, Jan 19, 2012
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2012
  2. Stavros

    Stavros Active Member

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    Post some pics and I can tell you a lot more. Want to see the compressor and turbine side, esp all the inlets and outlets. More pics the merrier.

    You have measured the a/r wrong without a shadow of a doubt.

    Going by the numbers, I 'think' you have a 7cm housing- Look inside the turbine inlet, it should be just inside there, a number 7 or whatever.

    A compressor good for ~600bhp is more than a little overkill for someone wanting 380bhp regardless of housing, but HY35s are good.

    T2 with a slightly rounded inlet port shape is fine and pretty normal on T2 flanged holsets and many others.

    The turbo you describe is very odd indeed from what you describe, meaning its a hybrid (unlikely), or something isn't quite what you think it is (much more likely).

    You REALLY need to take the compressor housing off and measure the compressor inducer and exducer to confirm what that is.

    As yeah, get me some pics and I can help you.
     
  3. Munkul

    Munkul Active Member

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    cheers, i was hoping you'd know something :)

    compressor wheel is a 7 blade with inducer 52mm, exducer 76.4 (or thereabouts? wheel OD is 80mm but the blades dont extend that far)

    There is a random 7 on the turbine housing - looks like this on one side: 7 164 02 TW 2. I see nothing inside the inlet.

    the idea behind this turbo choice is that with a "regular" 9cm housing it should do 400whp all day long with good torque, so if I start my aims at 350whp I cant be too disappointed...

    I will get some good pics tonight some time :)
     
    #3 Munkul, Jan 20, 2012
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2012
  4. Munkul

    Munkul Active Member

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    here are pics. I found the 7 in the inlet!!! Dunno why I hadnt spotted it before now.

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  5. Munkul

    Munkul Active Member

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    So its safe to assume that this is a 7cm housing then... so what does that implicate for my power ambitions?

    From what I read about td05's with 7cm housings on EJ20's, they start to choke early around 350bhp, although can push to 400bhp on e85.
    Given that my turbine wheel is quite a bit bigger than a td05 one though, does this not mean it will flow more?

    Starting to wonder if this turbo is a bad idea... surely with the wheel sizes it will spool slower than a td06 and have less of a top end.... cos thats half of what i'm after - a stonking top end power band!

    Also that comp wheel is damaged to the point that im not sure how safe it is to run... if I use it it will be getting checked for balance first at the very least.
     
  6. Stavros

    Stavros Active Member

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    Interesting! But odd!

    What's the numbers on the plate on the compressor housing? I got a cracked version of the Holset parts catalogue so I can look things up, it wont give us all the answers but it will give some idea.

    Thats no way a 'normal' HX35/HY35 compressor wheel, you can see from the pics (from the thickness of the wall between the wheel and the MWE ports) its got a smaller inducer, and you say yourself its 52mm, and the usual 8 and 7 blade ones are 56mm, so it sure aint a 600bhp compressor.

    There ARE others, as small as 46mm and as big as 60mm, but they're not common, I'm not sure what they're off tbh.

    That turbine inlet port shape is totally fine, but if its deffo T2, I've never seen that before either.

    Comp wheel damage sounds worrying though.

    If you dont decide to run it, lemme know, I might be keen if its cheap.
     
  7. Munkul

    Munkul Active Member

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    with difficulty, I THINK ive managed to get all the numbers right, they are shite to read, lol

    4031308
    H860900990
    2066012010
    HY35W

    If you could find me a part number for the comp wheel it would be awesome, cos I half fancy trying for a new wheel and going it a go anyways... worst case scenario I need to change housing and weld a T3 flange back on the manifold...

    Any thoughts on how it would actually perform with the small housing?

    Cheers!
     
  8. Stavros

    Stavros Active Member

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    Woopah, found it!

    You REALLY wouldn't guess what it's from, and that explains why we've never seen it before!

    It's off a Yanmar 6BY260, which might not mean much to you, but it's a late spec direct injection BMW 330D engine modified for boat use and pushing out 260bhp and 400lbft!

    The turbo was changed for a slightly different version in 2009, so yours is not available anymore but the new version looks about the same to me, the number for that one is-2836707

    Your turbo is- 4031308
    Repair kit is- 4027873
    A complete new CHRA is- 4032059
    A new compresor wheel is- 3599650
    Think standard boost was about 35psi by the looks of it, but I'm not sure on that one.

    In fact, here's a video of a boat with your turbo on, and you can clearly see it, lol...


    Personally I think it's FINE with that turbine housing on it, well quick spool and good power, at least 375-400bhp at high boost IMO, and that's about the limit of the stock manifold anyhow. And at high boost you'd have the same torque as power.

    If you wanted more, get a different turbo rather than modify that one, as TBH I think it should work damn well for what it is.
     
    #8 Stavros, Jan 21, 2012
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2012
  9. Munkul

    Munkul Active Member

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    You sir, are a fucking legend!!!!!

    I really did suspect it was a marine turbo, cos if the way the corrosion looked salt related.

    I'm gonna suck it and see, I think :D
     
  10. Stavros

    Stavros Active Member

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    Yeah I know, lol. TBH it took some serious effort to get hold of this Holset thing to find all that info, but I got hold of one a little while ago.

    Not your usual marine turbo for sure, fuck, its really not your usual marine engine! But a fucking cool one.

    Deffo try it out, I reckon it'd be a shithot turbo.

    Your comp wheel, albeit rare, is used on 51 different applications, almost all HX35Ws in all kinds of wierd applications, so it sholdnt be too hard to find.

    BUT! Your turbine housing AND turbine wheel is unique, they the only engine it's used on, so they rare as fook and you couldn't just swap housings as none of the others would match!

    If you need any other part number for the turbo, lemme know.

    For some reason it wont give me part numbers for most the bits on the 09-on version of your turbo, but I reckon it's probably because they're the same as yours.
     
  11. 4_Stroke

    4_Stroke Member

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  12. Stavros

    Stavros Active Member

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  13. Munkul

    Munkul Active Member

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    I had a bit of an idea that you could help, but that sort of info is more than I ever could have expected! So thanks very much :)
     
  14. Munkul

    Munkul Active Member

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    After a bit of research, those Yanmar engines can do 310-340bhp and over 650lb-ft according to a couple of remappers/tuning chip companies.

    Now surely this means this turbo should flow for 350whp+ on petrol? After all, the Dodge boys only push the HX35's to 400bhp in the cummins 12v engines, and they are obviously capable of 450bhp+ on petrol engines.
     
  15. Stavros

    Stavros Active Member

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    As I said mate, IMO 375-400bhp shoulnt be a big deal at high boost, quite likely more.

    TBH there are 52mm comp inducer turbos around good for over 500bhp, and IMO that turbine sounds ok for decent power as long as you not expecting it at 1.2bar
     
  16. Munkul

    Munkul Active Member

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    hmm... high boost, not so keen on... yeah I'm a wimp but i'd rather not stress the engine too much. I wasnt thinking of running any over 1.4bar, although I havent spoken to any pro tuner about this yet.

    fuck it, with cheap turbos like this best thing to do is bloody try it instead of pontificating on forums :D suppose WI could help if I really wanted to chase the power...
     
  17. Stavros

    Stavros Active Member

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    1.4-1.5 might get you there! Thats not THAT low.

    It'd det that kills engines, not boost.

    IMO no need for WI either.

    Give it a go, I reckon it'll be good if that compressor wheel is ok
     

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